(A page from the calendar). In Warsaw another summer day – hot, humid, flies slicing through the air, a storm is coming. A thin t-shirt warms like a sheepskin, lowered blinds give shade and the illusion of coolness. I connect with Olivier online, I can't hear him yet, but I can already see him: smiling, dressed in a white heavy-cotton sweatshirt – he’s sitting against a window, beyond which the wind rocks rain-dampened bushes. When his voice joins the picture, he says that he and his wife had to take their three children out of Paris because it was unbearable there. They chose Brittany as the place of escape, to live for a while at a different, slower pace, so the children could have a carefree summer and the adults could work remotely. Along with calm, the ocean and greenery, they also got cold and rain. We talk about the charms of workation and about how in summer we prefer Stockholm to Venice (Olivier is half Swedish). As if we had known each other for a long time. But that's not true — a dozen minutes earlier I had seen him on my laptop screen for the first time.

The name of your brand – Ex Nihilo – briefly tells its story. How did three people, none of whom is a perfumer, successfully break into this hermetic world?

It's thanks to our differences. We have different temperaments, skills, professional experiences. We complement each other perfectly. And on top of that, we get along extremely well. Benoît comes from the south of France; I met him in Paris while studying at the Institute of Political Studies. He has been my best friend for over 20 years, the godfather of my daughter. We were in the same year as Emmanuel Macron—he ended up as president, and we built a beautiful perfume brand out of nothing (ex nihilo) (laughs). But neither Macron assumed leadership of the state immediately, nor did we start a company right after graduation. Benoît went into building marketing strategy for luxury brands (LVMH, L’Oréal, Guerlain), I worked in banking. When we met, from time to time he would say how great it would be to start our own company dealing with luxury goods, for example men's fashion. I thought – it would indeed be nice; my grandfather was a tailor, so I was drawn in that direction. Then, because of Benoît’s experience, we began to think about the beauty industry. But everything remained theoretical. Until we were past 35 and by chance at a dinner with friends we met Sylvie, an engineer and graduate of the prestigious MIT (Massachusetts Institute of Technology), who nearly went to the Moon – after her studies NASA hired her. When we met her, she was working at Givaudan (one of the world’s largest manufacturers of flavors and cosmetic ingredients – ed.), researching possible applications of new technologies in the world of scent. We immediately liked her and it quickly turned out we shared the same dream: to found a company that would create something beautiful, luxurious, something that brings people joy. After a few meetings we knew it should be perfumes. We decided to quit our previous jobs and start building that “something” out of nothing. It may seem crazy, but it had solid foundations. If you wanted to play at creating a psychological map – in our case all areas would be occupied. Sylvie perfectly understood the world of scent and technology, Ben, our creative spirit, knew the inner workings of luxury brands, and I was responsible for finance and knew how to invest wisely.

How do you turn dreams into reality?

I don't know (laughs). A moment ago we had a tiny office in Paris, about 15 square meters. Today you are interviewing me, more than 100 people work for us in different parts of the world, we have boutiques in the most prestigious locations in London, New York, Dubai. As if a good dream came true. And yet Ex Nihilo is not backed by a genius founding nose we could boast about, there aren't centuries of history or archives to draw from. Perfumers who created our first fragrances were given free rein in choosing ingredients, but they had to start from nothing. It turned out to be a pretty good beginning.

Difficult?

For me, magical. On the occasion of the tenth anniversary of the brand we recalled that first year: from idea to the stage of working on perfumes. We worked without time limits, day and sometimes night – for twelve months. Finally, when the concept was clear, we decided to consult specialists at Givaudan. Precisely because we were not perfumers, we wanted to present the idea to industry experts. So the three of us went to the company and told them about our dream brand, about the vision, about how we wanted to be perceived in the scent market, what new things we proposed to customers. We were as nervous as hell; after two hours of presentation we received a standing ovation from twenty-five people, true veterans in their field. But the most important thing was that they wanted to work with us! We were surprised and honored.

What was to set you apart from other brands?

We wanted to be avant-garde while drawing from the tradition of perfumery, to reinterpret the most classic notes used in contemporary perfumery. For example Fleur Narcotique – a composition from our first series – is a contemporary variation on floral perfumes, rich and intoxicating. That’s how sophisticated, fashionable Parisian women smelled in the 1980s and 1990s. The creator of the composition, Quentin Bisch, decided to overdose one ingredient: a synthetic molecule called Petalia, which has the scent of peony mixed with rose, lily-of-the-valley and fruit. The move was risky, but it paid off, because the perfume gained a unique power without losing the lightness provided by the multidimensional Petalia. To this day Fleur Narcotique is one of our bestsellers.

You started in 2014 with eight compositions…

And we felt it was few. In our first boutique on Paris’s Rue Saint-Honoré 352 there were only eight bottles, while in other perfumeries the shelves were overflowing! However, we decided that our concept, which was also connected with architecture and design, needed space to fully resonate.

But in fact customers had more scents to choose from, because a machine enabling personalization debuted in the boutique – Osmologue.

That's true. From the beginning we were convinced that perfume is something intimate. As close to the person who wears it as underwear or even more. It should reflect and emphasize who you are now, how you feel. We felt the industry had forgotten that. When we started, on the Paris metro most women smelled of the perfumes by Dior that were popular at the time. Yes, beautiful, but when you smell them so often, at such intensity, they stop being personal and luxurious. So we decided to give each client the possibility of personalization. Osmologue is a device that large perfumery companies – like Givaudan – use to create scent compositions. We brought it into the boutique and gave it an individual dimension. We made it possible for customers to experience the process, to see and feel what it’s like to compose a perfume just for themselves.

How does it work?

You arrange a personal consultation with an expert in our boutique. First you choose a favorite scent from the Initiale or Babylone collection, then you adapt it to yourself by enriching it with one of the available essences like iris, vanilla, orange blossom, rose and others. We record the composition in a special form so the scent can be easily recreated later. Osmologue makes it possible to create something unique and to take part in the creative process. With such easy access to various goods, experiences become exceptionally valuable.

What do you tell perfumers you work with? Say, we want a light summer scent?

(Laughs). At Ex Nihilo we have two rules: no limits in choosing ingredients and no budgetary constraints. We come with an idea, discuss it, make sure we understand the “nose” and that’s it. We don’t conduct consumer tests; we promote what we consider good. The strength of niche brands is space for creative, free thinking. For example, for the tenth anniversary of the brand we decided to offer a scent that, however strangely it may sound, would concentrate knowledge and experiences gathered over a decade. That's how Blue Talisman was born – with bergamot, ginger, pear, cedarwood, the multidimensional synthetic molecule Akigalawood, and orange blossom.

What guidance did the composer of the composition receive?

Lots of images that we think are associated with the brand: Place Vendôme, jewels, mysterious symbols. And words: magic, treasure, hypnosis. We create a map of inspirations, go with the chosen perfumer to breakfast or lunch and see if there is a spark between us. Because this work is based not only on excellent craft but also on understanding certain emotions and the ability to evoke them. Some instantly know what we mean, like Jordi Fernández, the creator of Blue Talisman. Or Quentin Bisch – when he created Fleur Narcotique in 2013 he was the youngest perfumer at Givaudan! Today I think he is one of the best in the world. He immediately grasped our idea, even though we came from nowhere, without a track record or experience. Something clicked between us. We also worked wonderfully with Olivier Pescheux, who created, among others, Amber Sky – a rich scent with notes of sandalwood and cedarwood, nutmeg, geranium and coriander.

Does it happen that you talk to a perfumer and don't pursue the collaboration?

We met perfumers interested in working with Ex Nihilo, but we had the feeling that nothing spectacular would come out of the collaboration. There was no magical click (laughs). That happens in various creative industries, not just perfumery.

What have you learned over ten years of Ex Nihilo's existence?

That perfumery is the most beautiful field. And perfumers are open-minded people, ready to support and exchange views.

They don't compete with each other?

Maybe some do. But above all they are passionate people.

Each year a dozen new niche perfume brands are created. Aren't you worried about Ex Nihilo's future?

There’s room for people who have something interesting to demonstrate. When we debuted, we wanted to show how to combine tradition with the avant-garde. Now newcomers are tasked with pushing further boundaries. To drive the industry forward. We are curious about their ideas and open to collaborating with young perfumers and new brands.

How has the world of perfume changed over a decade?

The pandemic contributed to the emergence of a new, strong trend. For many years perfume was associated with seduction and eroticism – those names, packaging, advertising campaigns from the 80s and 90s. Covid-19 taught us that scent is not only a tool for seducers but something that can provide well-being to anyone. In lockdown it gave a sense of safety, made it possible to feel good despite everything, to wrap oneself in a cocoon of positive sensations. That message has stayed with us. Seduction stopped being the most important thing in the world of perfume. Stereotypes ended. We are forgetting divisions between men’s and women’s scents – our The Hedonist was created with men in mind, yet it has many female users. Conversely, the inherently feminine Fleur Narcotique is also used by men.

When did you feel that Ex Nihilo was on the right track, that you would succeed?

When we were promoting Fleur Narcotique, we went to New York and gave the perfume to the woman in charge of buying at the famous department store Saks Fifth Avenue. We went to dinner with her, she wore our perfume and during that evening six people asked her what she was wearing. She laughed that it acted like a magnet and… decided it would be sold at Saks! A few weeks later Sylvie and I were serving customers in our Paris boutique. Suddenly an energetic, beautiful woman stepped out of a group of shoppers and asked us to tell her about the brand because she didn’t know anything about it. At the end of our twenty-minute monologue she said: “I am head of buying at Harrods in London, I want you there!”. And on the day of our debut at Harrods we met Thierry Wasser, the famous nose of Guerlain; our counters were next to each other. He sniffed probably all Ex Nihilo perfumes and finally said that our brand would be heard about. Moments like that make you believe a lucky star watches over us, let you dream and move forward. They confirm we are doing a good job.

Celebrities liked your scents…

Hard to believe, but that was also a matter of chance. In 2013 Hailey Bieber, then Baldwin, came to Paris. By chance I found out which hotel she was staying at and we decided to send her a gift. We beautifully wrapped Fleur Narcotique, added a note and sent it. Some time later a friend called me and said: “Hailey Baldwin is talking about your brand in the New York Times.” My jaw dropped. She also showed the perfume in a video made for American Vogue. We never asked for that! Big corporations pay her millions of dollars for advertising; she just liked our small brand back then. We never met, but we know she is a regular customer, that she also liked Lust in Paradise, and that her husband Justin uses Ex Nihilo. She brought him to our boutique in Los Angeles. The manager called me and told me that one day a crowd gathered in front of the store; she went out to see what was happening and there was… Justin Bieber! “What did you do?”, I asked. She said: “I kept professional composure. But I was thinking the whole time: OMG, Justin in the boutique!” (laughs).

You seem interested in perfumery not only from a business perspective.

I owe that to my mother, for whom scents were always one of the most important sensual experiences. And it’s not about perfumes so much as smells in general. My father was a diplomat, so we visited lots of countries: the Philippines, Hong Kong, the USA, Canada. Everywhere, as soon as we got off the plane and stepped outside the airport, my mother would take a deep breath and urge me to do the same. She told me that each place, country, city has its own unique smell that helps you understand it. Thanks to her I still like to explore the world with my nose.

You still travel a lot. What are scent preferences like in different countries?

For example Poland, or rather Warsaw, because that's the only place I’ve been, is very avant-garde. When I arrived I immediately smelled the metallic scent of contemporary architecture and thought there is some creative spirit, ferment here. I like the energy and openness that Varsovians emanate. At Galilu I met very well-educated customers. I thought Poland was a country that loved delicate, neutral perfumes. But it isn't! Poles are bold, discerning consumers of complex compositions, often ambery and exotic. I fell in love with Warsaw – it acts on me like a magnet; I want to come back. And I think Ex Nihilo, with its unconventional approach to classics, fits perfectly with the Polish temperament.